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Colonel Marie-Christine Harvey: I do think we’re ready for all spectrum of conflicts with our Artillery; they’re clearly your fire power.

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Captain Adam Orton: Hi! This is Captain Adam Orton with the Canadian Army Podcast. And today, we’re going to talk about the Artillery. I’m talking to Colonel Marie-Christine Harvey. She’s the Army G3 and also has a huge Artillery background. And, she’s going to tell us what it’s like to be around the big guns. Good day, ma’am.

Col Harvey: Good day.

Capt Orton: So, tell us a little bit about yourself.

Col Harvey: Yeah, well Colonel Harvey. I actually joined the Forces at seventeen years old, in 1996. I joined as an Infantry Reserve private. So, with Régiment du Saguenay where I was actually living at that point in time, very quickly, I realized that I wanted to do this as a career and serve. So, a year later, I applied to go to RMC, Royal Military College. I’ve listed up all of the combat arms as choice up front. Then, as a spare, pilot—why not? I’m very happy that they called me to be an Artillery Officer. And, I joined RMC and now of course 24 years later I’m the Canadian Army G3.

Capt Orton: Wow, that’s quite a story. So, let’s talk about the Artillery a little bit. Nobody wants to hear about our staff officer stories. So, let’s get to the good stuff. Maybe for those listening at home, and also I’ll admit even as a sergeant, I didn’t always fully understand how the other organizations work. I vaguely knew they were in the Army, and they, you know, like I know the Artillery big guns, things happen. But, how does the Artillery work? What does the Artillery do?

Col Harvey: If I could describe the Artillery in a couple of words, I would say within your brigade—and I’m biased, I’m going to say this right up front.

Capt Orton: Right. We always are.

Col Harvey: This is the fire power of a brigade. So pretty amazing stuff that these units do, and those regiments do.

So, probably one of the things that everybody thinks, is that there are only big guns in those regiments. But really there are two batteries that are gun batteries. There is one battery that is an STA, Surveillance and Target Acquisition Battery. There is one battery that is one-hundred percent composed of FOO, Forward Observation Officer and JTACs, Joint Terminal Attack Controller. And, the fifth battery is actually HQ-6. So, this is a big organization. There is only one in each of the brigades so you have got to take care of them. And they will take care of you. And, they’re clearly your fire power.

Capt Orton: You got to really appreciate, also, the acronyms. And thanks for explaining that because sometimes we let that get away from us. So people at home now know what all of those letters mean. For those that may know their history more or less, if I think of the first World War, and things that were happening in Vimy, Artillery was rolling barrages and firing thousands and thousands of rounds. And, things have evolved over time—maybe some more, or some less. Can you talk to us a little bit about how the Artillery is used in the conflicts today?

Col Harvey: Actually, in conflict today, we do have some guns deployed in some of our operations. So, right now it’s a little bit more of a training mission, if I could say. But clearly, our guns have been employed in modern conflict in Afghanistan, in more of a conventional role with regards to employing them as a real fire power to support Infantry and Armoured on the battlefield. We’ve also deployed in Bosnia. And this one was more of a presence. But, every couple of months we did a big exercise to actually show that the Artillery and the Canadians and NATO were here, and ready to work as a team, if need be. So, and actually, I do think we are ready for all spectrum of conflicts with our Artillery. I do think we have a role to play in any of those types of conflicts. Your gunners are great integrators of effects. We also have Surveillance and Target Acquisition Battery—and I do think this is important also with regards to the capacity they can bring with the radar and their mini UAS. So, this is an important capability that we do have in the Canadian Army and the Artillery that can actually give an edge when deployed on operation.

Capt Orton: It’s interesting that you mentioned Afghanistan, I think back to my time there as a young private, and we were calling in danger close to Artillery. And we were behind a wall, and you can just hear these things coming in—just screaming in. Physics at work, like big 155 rounds, just screeching through the air. Just like “boom” and it’s a really impressive thing to experience—probably one of the most impressive moments in my career. Most Artillery people, I would say, or from my perspective, are on the other end of the gun. Do they get to see that, and experience that firsthand as well?

Col Harvey: Well, I did mention that there’s five different batteries. So, one of them is a battery of FOOs and JTACs. So, these batteries and all of the personnel within these batteries are actually up front with the Infantry, the Armoured, the Engineers, that are up front. Because, they are the one looking at that target and calling fires on that target. So, all of these members are clearly AVCI Artillery. Their role is to look at the target, call the grid of that target, and engage the target. So, they live and breathe that type of engagement. But, do we expose everybody that is on a gun to the type of effect they will bring to a battlefield? Absolutely. You’ve talked about the danger close during your training. We make sure that we do that danger close exercise in the bunker and that they see the effect of what they are delivering on the battlefield. They feel the importance also of what they can bring and do, and the difference they can make.

Capt Orton: Yeah, and I think one of the core training concepts is to train under demanding and realistic conditions to understand the effect you’re bringing to the battlefield is probably a pretty big part of that. So, we’re talking about the Artillery in general. What’s the difference between an NCM NCO in the Artillery, and the role of an Officer?

Col Harvey: First off, I want to say, I know every trade will say that, but we are nothing without our NCO and NCM supporting us. Everyone that is on a gun is actually an NCO with his member. In Infantry we call this a section, we call this a debt, so they are the one on that piece of equipment, managing it and owning it. So, they are extremely essential. On a gun position you will have all of the NCO and NCM managing the gun. But, there is also part of the recce party— but the recce party is actually led by an officer. And, in the command post, you will see NCO and NCM. But the command post officer is of course an officer. And, the overall gun position officer is normally a captain within the unit. But, all of these jobs kind of go one with each other, and nothing can happen if we don’t have the number one someone to shoot the gun, or the FOO party to call the fire on that target, and the command post to receive those orders. So, it’s all part of a big machine that comes together to engage the target.

So, a great opportunity for NCO NCMs, and great opportunity for officers. And, it’s the same for JTACs and FOOs. So there is a FOO, but inside of his party is one one-hundred percent NCO and NCM and there’s only one officer. And, the JTAC could be—I’ve seen from a bomber, to a sergeant and a warrant being JTACs and they actually have the most fire power that they can bring on a battlefield. So, that’s pretty impressive that you can achieve this in the Artillery. Whether you’re an officer or an NCM.

Capt Orton: So, there’s a lot of good opportunities on either side of the house. Now, you yourself are an officer and you know you’re talking about the G3, which is maybe more of a staff officer position. What does a career path look like for an officer?

Col Harvey: For me, I graduated from RMC, completed my last step or phase for training, then was posted to 5ieme RLC, so a unit in Valcartier to be a troop commander. Very lucky, because I deployed as a 2nd Lieutenant in Bosnia, with the guns, LG1s at that time to actually do operations out in Bosnia. After that, I came back to the unit, did my FOO course, and got exposed a little bit after that to brigade level, being the aide de camp of the brigade commander. Moved onto Afghanistan with the brigade commander. Came back, served again a little bit as a FOO with 5e RLC. But, I quickly transitioned into the training institution where I did a year-long course to become an instructor in Artillery. So, I went really deep into my trade. You talk about science as its best when you talk about Artillery. I kind of tend to agree. So, I did that course, and then taught for three years—mainly FOOs at the Artillery School in Gagetown New Brunswick. Came back to the unit, commanded a battery of FOOs and JTACs. And, then moved on to do a Toronto equivalent course in Australia. Then, of course, I needed to be exposed to a little bit higher level of planning and operations, so I went back to the Canadian Army HQ. Then, redeployed as a J5 in Kuwait and then came back for strategic experience as an ADM(RS) EA. And then, was selected to command 5ieme RLC. After completion of command, I actually came back as the Canadian Army G3.

Capt Orton: Definitely a lot of moving around there. This comes up in conversation all the time, but you know some people are like: “I don’t want to be cold and wet; office work is nice.” But, I think a lot of people once you’re out there, and doing the businesses, as we call it—you want to stay out there and you want to keep commanding that stuff to the tactical level. What’s the importance of moving around and doing all these different things? Why does that matter?

Col Harvey: I think it takes us a long time to actually acknowledge that we need to move. And, let go of the tactical piece. Because, I think this is why we join and we all absolutely love it. But it is important I kind of compare what we do to, at one point, you need to have a conductor in an orchestra. And in order to do so, you need to be exposed to a little bit of each instrument. To acknowledge that something is wrong with regards to your orchestra. So, I do think, if we want to take the best decision for the Canadian Army, for our organization, whoever is going to be a head of that organization needs to have been exposed to all of the assets or the facets of that organization. Whether it’s training, OPS, PERS, I think it is how the organization will grow. So we need to be exposed to all of these.

Capt Orton: So, now that we’ve kind of covered what it is all about. What kind of person are we looking for in the Artillery? We talked about a lot of physics, science, and math. Is that the kind of background that you’re looking for? What soft skills do you want an individual to have for them to be a good Artillery person?

Col Harvey: I’ll start by saying I have a degree in French Literature. So, I think we need to have an interest in science; we don’t need to have a deep background and education in science or math. Clearly, when we go on phase training, we will do a survey—you know, there is a portion of ballistics in there. And, I was extremely interested in that even though I have a degree in French literature. But I’ve seen various types—and that’s what we need, we want different types of leaders with different types of interests. But, clearly, if you can join that interest for science with that interest to serve in the combat arms, I think this is the perfect trade for you.

Capt Orton: So, we talked about the past of the Artillery—you know, the old school trench warfare bit, and kind of the present. You’re high enough that you’re in charge of army operations and stuff like that, without giving away too much maybe. Where do you see the trade heading these days?

Col Harvey: I do think it’s clear that we are working on an even longer-range type of weapons system. And, this is quite important in the modern battlefield. I also think that Surveillance and Target Acquisition is something we will see and even develop even further with better technology. And, that will be a great asset on the battlefield. And, this is where I think the two main focus areas where I think the Artillery is leaning towards.

Capt Orton: You’ve obviously done a lot of things, you’re a colonel now, and you’ve told us a little bit about your life story. Is there anything that particularly stands out in your experience? Maybe a memorable moment or a story that you’d like to tell us?

Col Harvey: I don’t think it is a story, but I can tell you the most memorable moment. And, I would have to go with the passion and dedication, when I was a CO of everybody that served at that unit. I do want to say that whether it’s in training, in operation, in real time—the sense of urgency that we call the sergeant on our guns, our number one, and all of its crew as, when they hear the words “fire mission,” to actually go help the Infantry, the Armoured, the Artillery that is up front, and deliver that effect, is absolutely fascinating, and I’m hoping that one day I will have the opportunity to serve with these people again—and see, once again, their level of dedication and passion for their trade.

Capt Orton: You know, I normally wouldn’t do this, but within the past couple of years, there have been some really good videos on either the Canadian Army Facebook or on YouTube. Take a look at it, because there are some really good videos of gun crews operating. And you’re right— they move really fast. And, it is pretty impressive to watch them work as a team. That is a pretty good image of teamwork right there.

Col Harvey: Absolument.

Capt Orton: Alright. Well I think that is a pretty good note to end it on.

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Capt Orton: Thanks again, ma’am for coming out.

Col Harvey: Thank you. Ubique!

Capt Orton: Ubique! That’s right. So that was Colonel Marie-Christine Harvey. She is the G3 and has a background in Artillery.

For those of you just joining us, don’t forget to subscribe, and check our back catalogue of episodes, there’s some good material in there. And, stay frosty!

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